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David Cole on what we can learn from the marriage equality and gun rights movements

How I Learned to Love Shrimp 24 September 2025


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A podcast showcasing innovative and impactful ways to help animals and build the animal advocacy movement. Amy Odene & James Ozden talk to experts about a variety of topics: animal rights, animal welfare, alternative proteins, the future of food, and much more. Whether it's political change, protest, technological innovation or grassroots campaigns, they aim to cover it all with deep dives we release every two weeks.

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David Cole is a professor of constitutional law at Georgetown University, a regular contributor to the New York Review of Books, a former national legal director of the ACLU and author of the popular book on social change in the US, Engines of Liberty. This book, a must-read for anyone interested in social movements, is the focus of our discussion today.

We spoke about the importance of local organising for political momentum, why incremental progress has seemed to work for other issues, the role of in-person community in social movements, and other lessons from the US marriage equality and gun rights movements.

Chapters:

  • The book in a nutshell (00:03:45)
  • Why incrementalism was crucial for marriage equality (00:09:36)
  • What can we learn from the NRA and gun rights? (00:17:19)
  • Why socialising & identity formation are key for movements (00:23:32)
  • Symbolic vs high-impact campaigns (00:32:11)
  • Messaging strategies in the NRA vs marriage equality (00:36:58)
  • Dave & James debrief and key takeaways (00:40:30)

Resources: 

With thanks to Tom Felbar (Ambedo Media) for amazing video and audio editing!

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Penny Tehilah on uniting “welfarists” and “abolitionists” through pressure campaigns

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share playlist_add
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